Barrel Why Fouling Shots ?

Discussion in 'General Sako Discussions' started by Bucktote, Jul 18, 2021.

  1. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Why a Fouling shot?
    After a succesful hunting trip or a day at the range, most of us clean our rifles shortly after returning home. We use various solvents, Copper cleaning agents etc. The next time when we want to check zeroed POI we shoot a fouling shot ot two, why is this necessary?
    Having shot numerous rounds thru the fine Sako barrels, surely with errosion gasses, that preceed projectiles (about 70% of the hot gases) and the abrasion from bullets the lands should be smoothed out & any solvents or oils should be burnt up by the preceeding hot gasses. As a boy I watched my dad rod the barrel of his Remington
    30-S rifle with lapping compound. Is all this cleaning necessary only to be negated by foueling shots. After all it is the first shot in a hunting situation that is the one that counts, is not better to take that all important shot with a clean barrel? I understand cleaning preserves the steel by eliminating corrosisve agents that remain in the bore after shooting, but what mechanical reason is there for a foueling shot? I would say that in a new barrel there are some rough edges that final polishing in manufacturing may have missed, But in a seasoned barrel why is a foueling shot necessary? Maybe I have too much time to ponder these and other mysteries in th shooting relm?
    B/T

     

  2. bigcountry4me

    bigcountry4me Well-Known Member

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    I’ll equate it in my world. Nearly 100% of all my rifles shoot a flier high and left after cleaning, like clockwork. So typically, I don’t clean a rifle once range work is completed-until after hunting season. If I’m at the range and I decide to clean my rifle, I’ll then “call a flier” which equates to a fouling shot-then typically it settles right back to zero. I don’t want to have a flier be my first round in a hunting scenario. Others may see it differently or do it differently, this is my preference and it provides me with a level of assurance and confidence. Thanks
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2021
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  3. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the reply Bigountry4me,
    I guess it's like an asprin, don't know how it works, it just does!
    Like the Sargeant says " Damd it Just do it!! BUT it does make me wonder?
    B/T
     
  4. icebear

    icebear Sako-addicted

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    I have results similar to Bigcountry's with certain rifles (by no means all). One that sticks out in memory is my .30-o6 Krico 700, which has a rather skinny barrel. It consistently puts the first shot an inch or two from the other two (from a 3-shot detachable mag), which are usually quite close together. I have never been entirely certain whether this results from initial fouling or from the barrel heating up on the first shot. It's an annoyance on the range, as it blows group size up over an inch, but it wouldn't seem to make much difference on a deer, moose, or other game you might shoot with a .30-06.
     
  5. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Icebear,
    I don't mean to say that it doesn't happen, just what is the mechanism for it to occur? It seems to be the norm for everyone I talked to through out the years. All say shoot a foueling shot after cleaning. Guess it's like the Gremlins that used to plague my B-47s Starter Gennerators on occasion. Gen. Le May did not tollerate late take offs. They would crap out after our preflight start check.Thank heaven they were a quick changeout, but it sure made my blood pressure go up !
     
  6. stonecreek

    stonecreek SCC Secretary Forum Owner SCC Board Member

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    It certainly IS the first shot that is the most important in any hunting situation. Whether the second through fifths shots "group" particularly well or not is pretty immaterial since the object of your hunt will almost certainly be on the run after the first shot.

    Cleaning fluid residue left in the barrel will almost certainly put the first shot somewhat out of the center of the zero. To check my hunting rifles I will (1) clean the barrel at the end of hunting season, (2) check the zero before the next hunting season after firing a couple of fouling shots, (3) check the point of impact of the first shot the next day (or whenever the barrel is cold) to see that it is where it should be. I don't clean the barrel again until after hunting season. This way I am assured that the first shot goes where the crosshairs say it is supposed to go, and if the "warm" barrel group is an inch or so away it is not an issue.
     
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  7. Chrisss31

    Chrisss31 Member

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    I'm with stonecreek. I'put 5-6 shots through my .308 hunting rifle at the start of the season to check the zero. Then, I don't touch the bore until hunting season is over.

    On the flip side, I have a mod 85 varmint gun in .204 that always needs to be cleaned at the end of the day. It will never shoot at zero two days in a row if the bore isn't cleaned before it sets for the night. If I start with clean bore I get 1-2 fliers and then it's spot on.
     
  8. kevinlg

    kevinlg Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if anyone uses Lock-Ease as a post bore cleaning bore conditioner and storage treatment.

    Over the years I've found most of my "shooters" put the first shot within about 0.5"(@ 100 yards) of the normal grouping.

    Just a thought on a rainy Sunday.........
     
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2021
  9. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Hi fellows,
    While having time to think of little things( like when you are mowing food plot weeds) I waas thinking, what happens on the first shot after cleaning a rifle barrel? I mean what is the mechanical / chemical reason for the shot to print off zero? Could it be that the oil/solvent residue is ignited, causing internal pressure for a micro second while the bullet is moving down the barrel causing the bullet nose to cant ever so sligfhtly and not print to last zero? maybe it takes 2 shots to burn off all the residual foueling fuels in the barrel. Could it be that a swabbing with alcohol just before shooting, allowing the alcohol to evaporate, thus clearing the unwanted fuel in the barrel would then permit true shot placement? Not a problem to give a guy
    much cause for concern, just an old mans musing while the monotany of riding the tractor for a long time in the GA sun! Maybe I'll try it. B/T
     
  10. stonecreek

    stonecreek SCC Secretary Forum Owner SCC Board Member

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    I'm not sure. But treating the shooter with alcohol prior to shooting might have the effect of steadying the nerves and improve accuracy. I have a friend who refers to his favorite beverage as "group tightener".
     
  11. Spaher

    Spaher Well-Known Member

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    Stonecreek, I'm all in on the concept of fouling shots....cheers....
     

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  12. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Oh you Texas guys !!.
    I shudda known better, Wild Turkey will never be seen in my gun barrels. Yea too much time on the tractor joslin my brains & bladder, but that old farm is my therapy, my happy place a place where all my cares & concerns have a way of disapearing specially when looking at little holes in paper 100 yds away, while marveling how wonderful,this piece of wood & steel is.
     

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    Last edited: Aug 2, 2021
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  13. Bernie’s Dad

    Bernie’s Dad Well-Known Member

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    I am marveling at how you seem to be an ambidextrous shooter!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  14. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Hi Bernies Dad,
    I'am not. As a boy I was naturally left handed and my parents made me change to RH. But I am left eye domanant so when i got older I naturally shoot left handed. However there were not many left handed rifles in my family and they were not so available in the market place. I quickly learned to roll the rifle over & work the bolt when needed. For a long time I shot a BAR and it solved the problem. Now I just roll the rifle over & work the bolt, try it, not hard although I would rather have a LH bolt, but at this time of life no big deal!!!
     

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  15. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    I'm not, as a child my folks made me change to RH, but I am left eye domanant so I shoot LH. I used to shoot a BAR .243 and it didn't matter, but I learned to roll the bolt action rifle over & work the bolt Years ago there wern't so many LH rifles available so I adapted. Pics below my .243s I said I would not by another RH bolt. but when I saw the Forester The wood got me. So my bolts are typically RH action LH shooter as you see my 30/06 AV in the previous Pic. B/T!

    Sorry for the duplicate post thought I lost the first post I was interupped & lost my place B/T
     

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  16. Bernie’s Dad

    Bernie’s Dad Well-Known Member

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    My brother in law is a lefty but shoots a right handed bolt. I guess there just aren’t so many lefty guns out there. Try the Ruger No 1. It’s ambidextrous!


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  17. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Thanks,
    I don't think I will get any more, I found a lefty in a strange Cal. but I was uncomfortable because The barrel may have modified to an Ackley? But never say never!!
    B/T
     
  18. Bucktote

    Bucktote Well-Known Member

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    Hi fellow Sako shooters,
    I have just swabbed my two Sakos barrels with alcohol, NOT the drinking kind. I will go to the range at the farm tomorrow and have prepared (labeled) a target for 1st shots after cleaning & swabbing. Hopefully removeing all the cleaning solvents & oil residue that may have been in the barrels. I hope the shots are close to where the bullets impacted the last time they were shot. I have the old targets! Will report the findings! B/T
     
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  19. Chrisss31

    Chrisss31 Member

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    I'm curious about how this is going to work out!
     
  20. Bernie’s Dad

    Bernie’s Dad Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]


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